you kno it.
xx
 

You should check this band out, they're going to be huge:
http://www.myspace.com/thisisenergy
 

Prop 8 is interesting whilst i have no issues with people having homosexual relationships, I dont think that Marriage should be recognised between the same sex, how would they change their last names?
Marriage is something that is apparently where a couple should be when they choose to have kids, thats not the case these days and by allowing this we're only watering down the whole concept of marriage which is a huge shame, with divorce so easily available i wouldnt be surprised if it just fades out altogether in 100 years time, it really wont be worth the paper its written on
 

Are you serious? You really think Marriage Equality is shroude with difficulties in name changes, and that it will just water down marriage because of the current divorce rate?!

But, you don't mind if people have homosexual relationships.


What is your point?

Anyone can legally change their name. Common law in many, if not all states provides that a person's name is what ever they say it is.


My same-sex parner - aka HUSBAND, and I have been together for 22+ years. Through the bitter and the sweet, good tmes and hard times.


What you seem to take for granted - we accomplish by choosing to BE Together - I don't care what the Popular Vote says - NO ONE can stop me from refering to my HUSBAND as MY HUSBAND! We are not worried about the "Name Thing" you refer to - already have it figured out.


Is it not incredible that we live in a country where we can BOTH voice our views - perhaps agree to disagree? Imagine that!

All due respect, thank you for sharing.

 

Hey
Thats one aspect of the marriage, not the be all and end all, I think its completely fine for people to live in homosexual partnerships, as I stated in a reply below some of the most amazing people I know are in homosexual relationships.

Should their marriage be recognised... NO because Marriage is a vow to GOD, not to people! (A point often overlooked) of your love, I dont recall God saying please can the men marry men and women marry women, Point that out to me in any bible, or religious book of any significance.

The other issue I have with it is children and how they fit into the equation, one parent is is related to the child in the relationship and the child is missing a mothers love or a father figure, you can call your partner a husband but that doesnt mean that they experience the emotions of a man, think like a man and hence provide a masculine role model to the child or vice versa.

We have in modern day society Step Families and you could say yes one parent isnt related to the child, but they have a role model of both genders to best understand what the child is going through.

Im not american, im English.

Good luck in your relationship btw
 

excuse me but your ignorance is showing
get a dictionary Reconized
how would they change their name.....stupido it is not Required
my sister and her husband, married for 40 year, knew from the start that they could not have kids, so I guess they should not have been allowed to be married.

Makes as much sense as the Pope saying"... sexual intercourse, without the intent to procreate, is a sin." Guess they should not have been doing IT these many years.....damn sinners
Then you totally contradict yourself by saying it will "fade out"

My point is moot at this time seeing how California decided
The Wrong Way

I thought this was the land of the free
guess I was wrong
but you are still an idiot Prashant
 

Its spelling from the 'QUEENS English' not american! We use S's not Z's.

Your sister and her husband COULD potentially have children, miracle cures etc, how can two men have intercourse and have children? or two women? they have to:
1. go and get the eggs or sperm from a donor.
OR
2.
Adopt
So either one person is not related to the child, or both are not related to the child! How does the child feel about this?
How does that child get a solid male role model and motherly love from a gay couple? Its not in their natural instinct to be able to give both
Gay men don't feel the connection and emotion of a natural birth, Lesbian women (Granted some look like men) can not teach a boy to be like a man, they need role models.

If you learn how to read im saying that IF divorce continues at the rate it is and with the ease it is given in modern day society then Marriage will be worthless! it already is in some Western countries such as America, saying it isn't so doesn't make it fact but over 50% of marriages in America do not last.

The arguments you make are nothing more than vague points grabbed from thin air re: the Pope. they are not really suitable analogies.

Come back with facts and discuss it, but to be fair you are probably some ill fated uneducated redneck who doesn't even know what homosexual is.

As it is, homosexuals do a lot for the community, economy and are usually fantastic people... Should their marriage be recognised... NO because Marriage is a vow to GOD, not to people! of your love, I dont recall God saying please can the men marry men and women marry women, Point that out to me in any bible, or religious book of any significance.

Grow a brain cell you cretin (look that up in an urban dictionary)
 

Marriage, as it was being voted on, is a legal matter not a religious one. If your beliefs are based on GOD and the Bible, I feel sorry for you. There is no God and the bible was written and translated by men, primarily to control the masses. Have you ever even met any children from a "gay" family. I know a couple and they seem to be as well adjusted and messed up as any kid from any family.

The Queen's English, huh? Didn't spell that right either.


The divorce rate in the U.S. is not 50%. Get your facts straight, pun intended.

www. divorcereform. org/nyt05. html
 

Prove to me that there is no god? Why do millions of civilisations split across continents that were completely unconnected believe in the same concept?
Yes I have met children from a 'Gay' family and they would openly for the most part say that they missed having a role model of the opposite gender to their parents and missed out on quite a bit in fact.

The divorce rate in America for first marriage, vs second or third marriage
50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second and 74% of third marriages end in divorce, according to Jennifer Baker of the Forest Institute of Professional Psychology in Springfield, Missouri.
”
http://www. divorcerate. org/
Have a read
 

Yo a dumbass.
 

Prop 8 is interesting whilst i have no issues with people having homosexual relationships, I dont think that Marriage should be recognised between the same sex, how would they change their last names?
Marriage is something that is apparently where a couple should be when they choose to have kids, thats not the case these days and by allowing this we're only watering down the whole concept of marriage which is a huge shame, with divorce so easily available i wouldnt be surprised if it just fades out altogether in 100 years time, it really wont be worth the paper its written on

Why shouldn't it be recognized between same sex couples? Marriage is a close and intimate union between two PEOPLE. You don't have to change your last name when you get married either its your own choice if you want to take your spouses last name. We aren't watering down a thing! Prop eight is unfair and unconstitutional.

I'm glad it didn't pass!
 

...it did pass.

and as far as the "change the last names" thing goes, in most states, when you get married you can change your last name to ANYTHING. Either partner's name, a hyphenated name or a completely new name. So... that's not really a legit concern. Just sayin.
 

When a man & woman get married they don't have to change your last name, ever. My mother kept her name, and I'm keeping mine. A man can even take his wife's last name, and some people combine their last name into one long last name, these are not very common but do happen. So changing their last names isn't an issue at all.
 

You should check this band out, they're going to be huge:
http://www.myspace.com/thisisenergy
 

Obama 338
McCain 127


:)
 

Obama: 102
McCain: 34


:) ALMOST THERE!


No on 8, forreal.
 

If only people could stop being so frightened of "the other" things in this world would get a lot better. The root of all evil is fear. The root of all harmony is love...ALL types of love.
No to Prop 8!
 

BOOOO Jason,

Changing a definition does not give you "rights". The RIGHTS have already been given through process called civil union. Thanks for believing I should be Party A instead of a Bride. Who's going to pay for all those marriage certs to be reprinted? Why did the teachers union give one million if this doesnt impact kids? Dude, don't buy the LIE.
 

Jesus, what's so bad about being Party A? Are you wearing a pretty dress? Are you going to throw a big party later? After that, are you going home with Party B, there to be a part of Party B's existence till death or irreconcilable difference do you part? Then call YOURSELF a Bride and shut up.

As a sidebar, major respect to katie.doom for a point well-phrased. Huzzah, lady.
 

Ahh yes, the lie... the lie that as a lesbian, I deserve none of the same rights that you get as a heterosexual female. The right that you get to domestic abuse protection. You and your spouse both get to access school and medical records for your children. You get to make medical decisions for your spouse, and be considered "next of kin" if something happens. You don't have to pay taxes on transfer if your spouse leaves you a house in their will. You can adopt without having to worry about who knows and who doesn't know that you're married. You get payment of wages and worker's compensation if your spouse were to die. You get funeral and bereavement leave. You get joint adoption and foster care. Joint filing for taxes and bankruptcy. Spousal privileges in court cases. I could go on and on...

You take these things for granted. I am NOT a subhuman, I deserve the same things. Love is love is love is love... no matter how you slice it.
 

I have nothing against you being lesbian, that is your choice. But marriage should be between a man and woman, as it always have been. You don't have less rights, and thats not what voting yes represents. It is just to keep marriage heterosexual. I agree you should have rights, but I strongy believe marriage is heterosexual- and only heterosexual.
 

stephenson, can you tell me when you chose to be heterosexual?
 

I completely agree.... Thanks!
 

true that, you can't help who you fall in love with. same sex or not.
it is love
 

hmmmm....I do believe that we can always choose who we will be attracted to. We always have a choice in the way that we act and react in every place and situation. It's a crazy crazy thing when some one realizes the actual inner power that they hold over their own thoughts and lives, and how many people don't realize that we do hold this ability to always be exactly who they want to be. We define ourselves by choice, whether we realize it or not.


And the use of the word religion really bothers me. People fail to realize that by the most basic definition, every single person on this planet has a form of "religion". Every person holds some sort of beliefs that they believe in practicing every single day. Even if someone believes in nothing every day of his/her life, by believing religiously in nothing, it is therefore a self-defined religious belief system. Even if you are adamantly anti-religious. That anti-religious belief is categorized in a whole religiously practiced belief category of it's own. It is a belief system that a person or persons of like minds practice each and every day... Every person has a group of beliefs about life and how it should be lived, and lives it every single day. A group of "religiously" practiced beliefs= a religion. So therefore, every one is religious... even atheists are religious. Atheists believe in themselves and in death. Secular humanists believe in self power and human power. Christians believe in a supreme Creator. We all believe something...

Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

hmmmm....I do believe that we can always choose who we will be attracted to. We always have a choice in the way that we act and react in every place and situation. It's a crazy crazy thing when some one realizes the actual inner power that they hold over their own thoughts and lives, and how many people don't realize that we do hold this ability to always be exactly who they want to be. We define ourselves by choice, whether we realize it or not.


And the use of the word religion really bothers me. People fail to realize that by the most basic definition, every single person on this planet has a form of "religion". Every person holds some sort of beliefs that they believe in practicing every single day. Even if someone believes in nothing every day of his/her life, by believing religiously in nothing, it is therefore a self-defined religious belief system. Even if you are adamantly anti-religious. That anti-religious belief is categorized in a whole religiously practiced belief category of it's own. It is a belief system that a person or persons of like minds practice each and every day... Every person has a group of beliefs about life and how it should be lived, and lives it every single day. A group of "religiously" practiced beliefs= a religion. So therefore, every one is religious... even atheists are religious. Atheists believe in themselves and in death. Secular humanists believe in self power and human power. Christians believe in a supreme Creator. We all believe something...

Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

Why No on 8

Clever magicians practice the art of misdirection -- distracting the eyes of the audience to something attention-grabbing but irrelevant so that no one notices what the magician is really doing. Look over at that fuchsia scarf, up this sleeve, at anything besides the actual trick.


The campaign promoting Proposition 8, which proposes to amend the state Constitution to ban same-sex marriages, has masterfully misdirected its audience, California voters. Look at the first-graders in San Francisco, attending their lesbian teacher's wedding! Look at Catholic Charities, halting its adoption services in Massachusetts, where same-sex marriage is legal! Look at the church that lost its tax exemption over gay marriage! Look at anything except what Proposition 8 is actually about: a group of people who are trying to impose on the state their belief that homosexuality is immoral and that gays and lesbians are not entitled to be treated equally under the law.


That truth would never sell in tolerant, live-and-let-live California, and so it has been hidden behind a series of misleading half-truths. Once the sleight of hand is revealed, though, the campaign's illusions fall away.


Take the story of Catholic Charities. The service arm of the Roman Catholic Church closed its adoption program in Massachusetts not because of the state's gay marriage law but because of a gay anti-discrimination law passed many years earlier. In fact, the charity had voluntarily placed older foster children in gay and lesbian households -- among those most willing to take hard-to-place children -- until the church hierarchy was alerted and demanded that adoptions conform to the church's religious teaching, which was in conflict with state law. The Proposition 8 campaign, funded in large part by Mormons who were urged to do so by their church, does not mention that the Mormon church's adoption arm in Massachusetts is still operating, even though it does not place children in gay and lesbian households.


How can this be? It's a matter of public accountability, not infringement on religion. Catholic Charities acted as a state contractor, receiving state and federal money to find homes for special-needs children who were wards of the state, and it faced the loss of public funding if it did not comply with the anti-discrimination law. In contrast, LDS (for Latter-day Saints) Family Services runs a private adoption service without public funding. Its work, and its ability to follow its religious teachings, have not been altered.


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That San Francisco field trip? The children who attended the wedding had their parents' signed permission, as law requires. A year ago, with the same permission, they could have traveled to their teacher's domestic-partnership ceremony. Proposition 8 does not change the rules about what children are exposed to in school. The state Education Code does not allow schools to teach comprehensive sex education -- which includes instruction about marriage -- to children whose parents object.


Another "Yes on 8" canard is that the continuation of same-sex marriage will force churches and other religious groups to perform such marriages or face losing their tax-exempt status. Proponents point to a case in New Jersey, where a Methodist-based nonprofit owned seaside land that included a boardwalk pavilion. It obtained an exemption from state property tax for the land on the grounds that it was open for public use and access. Events such as weddings -- of any religion -- could be held in the pavilion by reservation. But when a lesbian couple sought to book the pavilion for a commitment ceremony, the nonprofit balked, saying this went against its religious beliefs.


The court ruled against the nonprofit, not because gay rights trump religious rights but because public land has to be open to everyone or it's not public. The ruling does not affect churches' religious tax exemptions or their freedom to marry whom they please on their private property, just as Catholic priests do not have to perform marriages for divorced people and Orthodox synagogues can refuse to provide space for the weddings of interfaith couples. And Proposition 8 has no bearing on the issue; note that the New Jersey case wasn't about a wedding ceremony.


Much has been made about same-sex marriage changing the traditional definition of marriage. But marriage has evolved for thousands of years, from polygamous structures in which brides were so much chattel to today's idealized love matches. In seeking to add a sentence to California's Constitution that says, "Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized," Proposition 8 supporters seek to enforce adherence to their own religious or personal definition. The traditional makeup of families has changed too, in ways that many religious people find immoral. Single parents raise their children; couples divorce and blend families. Yet same-sex marriage is the only departure from tradition that has been targeted for constitutional eradication.


Religions and their believers are free to define marriage as they please; they are free to consider homosexuality a sin. But they are not free to impose their definitions of morality on the state. Proposition 8 proponents know this, which is why they have misdirected the debate with highly colored illusions about homosexuals trying to take away the rights of religious Californians. Since May, when the state Supreme Court overturned a proposed ban on same-sex marriage as unconstitutional, more than 16,000 devoted gay and lesbian couples have celebrated the creation of stable, loving households, of equal legal stature with other households. Their happiness in no way diminishes the rights or happiness of others.


Californians must cast a clear eye on Proposition 8's real intentions. It seeks to change the state Constitution in a rare and terrible way, to impose a single moral belief on everyone and to deprive a targeted group of people of civil rights that are now guaranteed. This is something that no Californian, of any religious belief, should accept. Vote no to the bigotry of Proposition 8.
 

sorry, I don't know why it posted twice
 

Hear, hear! I feel for all of those who've been harmed by the bigotry of the few Californians, and the like, that vote(d) based on mainstream media coverage and superficial reasoning. I say we take it to the Federal level and get rid of this ridiculous proverbial thorn in the side of America forever! Besides, doesn't everyone know by now to believe half of what you hear and part of what you see???? My mom taught me to investigate before I believe.
 

replying specifically to add the kudos. Again I say Huzzah.
 

Express yourself now. Get it out of your system. The day the try to make a law that discriminates against you, there will be people like me and Mr. Mraz who will vote against it, because we believe in equality for ALL people. Even ones like you.
 

Good news! There are multiple forms available now because people were expressing the same concern about the Party A/Party B thing.

Let them love. There's no reason to keep them from it.
 

They already do have the right to love. Multiple forms oh great...I can hear it now...press 1 if your gay...press 2 if your a breader....nice way to spend our taxes...
 

Yes, they have the right to love. We all get that. But, what you fail to realize is all of the rights they don't have without their union recognized by the state. Surely you can read? Katie.doom spelled much of it out for you. Ridiculous! Get a real argument! Sometimes I think freedom of speech should be regulated based upon education status.
 

not to mention the proper use of "your", my personal pet peeve!!! You're is the short form for "you are" as in ...press 1 if you're gay...So many people use the word your incorrectly.

 

Well fortunately for u Meliamonkey Obama will be spending some more of the taxes on education.


Yaaaay! Spelling lessons!
 

you should really learn how to spell.
 

yum bread! I'm a bread eater...

oh, wait... I think you meant breeder
 

You have the right to say what you wish. The world would be boring if we all agreed on everything.

Go Barr!
 

bob barr 08!!!!
 

Pfft Meliamonkey, If u have nothing good to say to Jason just don't click the comment button, pretty easy process mate. Go Jas and Obama! Unfortunately here in Australia we don't really get a say but our most recent national news polls show that if we could vote it'd be Obama all the way! Here's to good new leadership and equality for all. Much Love, Cam
 

Cam Nacson and the third wheel- I sat here reading and reading till i got to what you wrote. Don't comment if you have nothing good to say!!! works for me!! Amy= Love for everyone!!!!! that's my good comment of the day! smiles

Hope more people with try that one!
 

Our children are ALREADY being taught about gay marriage in public schools...

School holds surprise 'Gay' Day for kindergartners
Parents outraged at public elementary's secretive 'coming out' event

By Chelsea Schilling
© 2008 WorldNetDaily


SACRAMENTO, Calif. – Some parents are shocked to find their children are learning to be homosexual allies and will participate in "Coming Out Day" at a public elementary school tomorrow – and they claim the school failed to notify parents.



One mother of a kindergartner who attends Faith Ringgold School of Art and Science, a K-8 charter school in Hayward, Calif., said she asked her 5-year-old daughter what she was learning at school.



The little girl replied, "We're learning to be allies.

"

The mother also said a Gay Straight Alliance club regularly meets in the kindergarten classroom during lunch.



According to a Pacific Justice Institute report, Faith Ringgold opted not to inform the parents of its pro-homosexual activities beforehand. The school is celebrating "Gay and Lesbian History Month" and is in the process of observing "Ally Week," a pro-"gay" occasion usually geared toward high school students.



The school is scheduled to host discussions about families and has posted fliers on school grounds portraying only homosexuals. According to the report, a "TransAction Gender-Bender Read-Aloud" will take place Nov. 20. Students will listen to traditional stories with "gay" or transgender twists, to include "Jane and the Beanstalk.

"

Some parents only recently noticed posters promoting the school's "Coming Out Day" tomorrow – celebrated 12 days after the national "Coming Out Day" usually observed on Oct. 11. When WND contacted the school to confirm the event, a female representative replied, "Yes, it is scheduled on our calendar.

"

When asked if the school made any efforts to inform parents, she refused to answer and said Hayward Unified School District would have to respond to additional questions. However, the district did not answer its phones or e-mails, and a voicemail recording would not take messages. "Coming Out Day" is not listed on the district's online school calendar.



Some of the parents contacted Pacific Justice Institute for representation when they learned the school was pushing pro-"gay" events for young children without warning.



Brad Dacus, president of Pacific Justice Institute, said opponents of California's proposed ban on same-sex marriage, or Proposition 8, often say the measure would not have an effect on public schools – but this is one of many recent developments that prove otherwise.



"Do we need any further proof that gay activists will target children as early as possible?" he asked. "Opponents of traditional marriage keep telling us that Prop. 8 has nothing to do with education. In reality, they want to push the gay lifestyle on kindergartners, and we can only imagine how much worse it will be if Prop. 8 is defeated. This is not a scenario most Californians want replayed in their elementary schools.

"

Concerned individuals may contact Faith Ringgold School of Art and Science by e-mailing Principal Diana Levy or calling (510) 889-7399. The Hayward Unified School District can be reached at (510)784-2600 or by filling out the district contact form.
 

NO! How DARE they teach children to be tolerant at such a young age! What is this world coming to when we try to teach our children to love all people equally! I for one will not teach my children ANYTHING until they reach high school age! Man, these darn "pro-gays" are no better than terrorists! They are trying to take over the minds of our children so one day they can take over the world and turn EVERYONE of those poor little impressionable children into scary, nasty, immoral GAY people!!!
 

Are you fucking serious?! "They are trying to take over minds of our children so one day they can take over the world and turn EVERYONE of those poor little impressionable children into scary, nasty, immoral GAY people?!?!" What the fuck is wrong with you? That's not what they are after. They are after equality... which is completely ok in the eyes of our constituition! Fuck you for being so ignorant of that! Gay people aren't out to turn everyone gay... I am not gay but I would feel completely ignorant for saying that I get better rights than gay people. I don't care what you believe... don't teach your kids if you don't want to, but there are people who think different than you, and you need to deal with it.
 

thank god someone in this world has a little sense.
 

The only scary, nasty, immoral people around here sre you and the bigotted, small minded, immature people with the same oppinion as you!!
 

Oh my god you guys! If you had read any of my other posts you would know I was being TOTALLY sarcastic... I thought it was pretty obvious but I guess not! I am sorry I should have put a disclaimer... I didn't mean for anyone to take it seriously and get offended!
 

Oh my god that has to be the funniest thing I have read in a while. I can't believe people actually didn't get the sarcasm......really makes you question the effectiveness of our school systems
 

People do you really think she was being serious, honestly. But please attack the real ignorant people posting proff of there lack of education on this thread.