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Flying Spaghetti Monster



Last Updated: 12/6/2009

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Gender: Female
Status: Single
Age: 101
Sign: Aquarius

City: Somewhere
State: Louisiana
Country: US
Signup Date: 8/30/2005
Saturday, August 11, 2007 

Current mood:  cheerful
Category: Life
Okay okay, I know I promised a blog last week, but more important things arose...like school and going on vacation for a week at Lake Havasu.

I spent the last week at Havasu with someone who I consider to be my best friend.  Now, this may sound odd to you, but he is what many would paint as a fundamentalist Christian.  In fact, his entire family believes that every word of the entire Bible is the exact literal truth of God.  They don't deny the fact that they all believe that the Earth is about 6,000 years old, that there will be a Rapture, that the early Old Testament characters lived for almost a millenium, that there was a huge flood that covered the whole planet, and that evolution is both blasphemous and completely impossible.  Hell, even my friend's truck has a sticker on it saying, "Ten Commandments, Not Ten Suggestions."  And yes, he does believe I am going straight to Hell when I die and be burned alive for eternity.

But he's still my best bro'.

Funny, huh?  To be honest, my friendship with him is more meaninful than with most of my other heathen friends.  I've even endured the pains of attending his youth group a few times (partly out of curiosity and partly out of courtesy).  But what's really unique is the fact that he's actually willing to laugh at many of the blasphemous jokes made by me or on television (here's looking at you Simpsons, Family Guy).  We both saw the Simpsons Movie and he laughed the hardest at all of the jokes aimed at Christians (says Homer, "This book doesn't have any answers!").

But after going to Lake Havasu with him and riding around on Jet Skis, driving speed boats, cliff jumping, etc etc, I came to wonder if there were other people people out there who share a heathen/Christian relationship (by heathen, I mean non-fundamentalist Christian).  When people think of a fundamentalist, Pat Robertson or some similar nutjob comes to mind, always shouting hateful words at people purely because they don't share the same faith.  But I can honestly say that my friend is exactly like Pat Robertson without the needless religious hate, sexism, bigotry, racism, and hypocrisy.

From what I can tell, religion isn't what makes a person bad or good.  Both my friend and Robertson hold the same religious beliefs, but I'm pretty sure Robertson is the only one going to hell between the two.

So this blog is more of a question aimed at you, the readers.  Do you have a close friendship, or even a romance, with someone who holds ideals that are at odds with your own?  I've even heard of atheist/Christian married couples existing somewhere out there.  I'd even like to hear from friends who are politically incompatible.  Does it add or take away from your relationship?  Frustrate or englighten you?  Ultimately, do you believe you're better or worse off because your friend is so opposed to your ideals?

Or are you the type of person who sticks to your own flock?

Personally, I wouldn't want to change a thing since my friend's views do influence my own in positive ways.  In fact, I think I'm a better and more tolerant person because of it.  Being around people who think the same as you is nice, but it gets boring being around people who agree with everything you have to say.  Diverse belief, in my humble opinion, makes us wiser as we are exposed to dissenting opinions and attitudes.

-RAmen
Ryan the Rationalist

 
GOLD!!!!
 
Posted by Ryan the Rationalist on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 4:36 AM
[Reply to this
Karen (♥)
karen davison

 
My first love was a Satanist and at the time I was a very adamant Christian. We continued our relationship like this for a year until my faith broke because God refused to save him and his logic made much more sense that bible mumbo-jumbo. He also went though hell, you see I took him to church all the time and he even went to a Christian work camp with me... and suffered a panic attack... yeah. We had a very odd relationship, but it worked for 2.5 years.
 
Posted by Karen (♥) on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 4:40 AM
[Reply to this
Ryan the Rationalist

 
" Being around people who think the same as you is nice, but it gets boring being around people who agree with everything you have to say. Diverse belief, in my humble opinion, makes us wiser as we are exposed to dissenting opinions and attitudes."


I concur. I love making friends with people who challenge my mind.

In fact I have a good friend who was in my former Army unit who is extremely religious. We had great times debating our beliefs. Never once did we raise our voice, or call the other names.

To this day I still consider him a friend.
 
Posted by Ryan the Rationalist on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 4:45 AM
[Reply to this
[His Eminence] Prez

 
Nice way of looking at relationships.

I, personally, verbally batter anyone with either science or FSMism when I see a cross in their vacinity.
 
Posted by [His Eminence] Prez on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 4:47 AM
[Reply to this
BB
Brandy Pomeroy Brooks

 
My sister is a devout Christian, I am more of a spiritualist. She and I are finally good friends, but it took quite a while. She kept trying to convert me until I threatened not to come over any more. Now we have a mutual respect for each others views and opinions and actually, it makes for interesting intellectual debates. I wouldn't have it any other way. Her faith works for her, mine does for me.

BB
 
Posted by BB on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 5:00 AM
[Reply to this
Zachary "Biscuit" Jones

 
you are a very wise spaghetti monster
 
Posted by Zachary "Biscuit" Jones on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 5:47 AM
[Reply to this
steveo

 
One of the most interesting blogs I've read in quite some time.

I was raised in a Nazarene Christian family and I always questioned the beliefs. Most of my life, I don't remember really being faithful, I just went to church cause my family went, and I went to youth group cause my friends went. Church and youth group was like school in a way, I kinda pretended to listen but I'd sorta tune it out, and when it was over I'd talk to my friends about video games, music, movies, comic books, etc.

I never kept to my own flock. We had family friends that lived with us who were Buddhist. We had neighbors who were Atheists. From elementary school until now, I have had friends who were Atheists, Agnostics, Buddhists, Taoists, Christians, Catholics, Protestants, Jewish, Islamic, Pagans, Satanists, Hindu, Secularists, etc. It never bothered me that other people were a different religion than me.

Today, I am no longer of Christian faith. I am part of the Church of the SubGenius (creator of the Kansas-based TXH clench). I am also a bit of a secular spiritual and an existentialist-humanist. I have strong beliefs in peace, coexistence, and human rights. I just think everyone needs to stop getting bent out of shape about the whole religion thing, and stop with all the unnecessary religious hate and bigotry.
 
Posted by steveo on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 5:52 AM
[Reply to this
nick the pirate

 
one of my best friends is a hardcore christan roman chatholic, conservative. an im pretty much athiest and a liberal type. but were still wicked good friends. even when he says im goin to hell an i try an convince him that im god.
 
Posted by nick the pirate on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 6:46 AM
[Reply to this
Delete Me, No more myspace

 
I live in a community that is over fifty percent Mormon. I, myself, am an Atheist. I also tend to agree with the far, far left. This, needless to say, puts me at odds with most of the community most of the time.

Religion, for many, is a great thing. It introduces you to many people whom you already have something in common with, before ever meeting. Many friendships and romances have common beliefs, as beliefs often dictate the most basic of values.

With this said, I had and do have many strong friendships with those of the Mormon persuasion. If you know much about Mormonism, there are some pretty strange beliefs and basic principles. This conflict of beliefs did and does not come into conflict with many of my Mormon friendships. If anything, as the original post said, it introduces difference and makes for many a meaningful and deep conversation. There is the occasional, "Not believing in God is like not believing in Christopher Columbus." No, no my friend, not quite.

Difference in opinion is necessary in every aspect of life. Difference can breed contempt, but can also breed tolerance, and I tend to be an optimist. There is no doubt to many that I will burn. There is no doubt to me that many have wasted their lives on a fruitless venture. These assertions mean little in the presence of friends.

Thank you for the thought provoking read.

-RAmen
 
Posted by Delete Me, No more myspace on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 7:12 AM
[Reply to this
++Conflict Theorist++

 
well said and amazing. i feel humbled oh gret one. Please read my blogs and enlighten me with your comments.
 
Posted by ++Conflict Theorist++ on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 7:16 AM
[Reply to this
Ryan the Rationalist

 
I can absoluetly 100% be friends with absolutely anyone. All I ask is that you don't try to interject your religious beliefs into my political system.

That's pretty much my only boundry
 
Posted by Ryan the Rationalist on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 7:43 AM
[Reply to this
Ben
Ben Larson

 
It is very difficult maintaining a relationship when you are atheist/christian, but I have managed to stay married for almost 30 years by carefully avoiding conflict over religion.

I find it easier to be acquaintances of Christians, than I do of Republicans. As some Christians blame the Jews for killing their Jesus, I blame the Republicans for ruining my country that I gave 23 years of my life to defend.

I won't even associate with my brothers because they are Republicans, although I can overlook their fundamentalist beliefs.
 
Posted by Ben on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 11:27 AM
[Reply to this
Ryan the Rationalist

 
Great comment!
 
Posted by Ryan the Rationalist on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 1:24 PM
[Reply to this
Are you Ready for some Fight the Sky?

 
One of my best friends is a christian bastard, and I appreciate his company because he's so secure with his religion and is able to appreciate the fact that I don't have one. We can argue about it if we wish, but honestly don't see the point.
 
Posted by Are you Ready for some Fight the Sky? on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 1:07 PM
[Reply to this
Kevin

 
I've never met a Christian who read the Bible so I've never met one who could honestly say they believe it. They claim to. But you can't believe something you don't know. It doesn't work. So, I've never really been friends with a devout religious person. I don't even think I've ever met a jew and I know I've never met a muslim. Hmm.... But, praise the FSM for writing such a thoughtful blog!
 
Posted by Kevin on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 2:36 PM
[Reply to this
angie
Angie Hardy

 
Well said. My family is all Mormon and I was raised that way. I am now agnostic. While I do get frustrated by my family's views on homosexuality and the "role" of women, I love them dearly and wouldn't trade them for anything. I believe if one is always surrounded by people who agree completely, there is a possibility, maybe even a tendency, to become trenchant in one's views, and lose one's ability to think critically. Being exposed to diverse ideas and beliefs, rendered with respect, is what make life interesting and makes us better people.
 
Posted by angie on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 2:56 PM
[Reply to this
Ryan the Rationalist

 
*All Together Now*


RAAAAAAAAAAAAmen!
 
Posted by Ryan the Rationalist on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 3:20 PM
[Reply to this
Bryce [Linfield College FTW!!]
Bryce Borland

 
i'm a full-fledged agnostic and my girlfriend is a pretty devout christian. we've gotten into some arguments, just in the past couple days, but oddly we see everything almost identically. I found it odd how similar agnostics were to christians, maybe i'm more christian than i thought, or maybe she's more agnostic than she thinks, but none the less absolutely love the girl, and i actually feel better talking to her about these things, both of us 100% sure where the other stands, coming to terms with what each other believe and what logic they have behind it.

she also understands the bible isn't correct, as it's been re-written many many times for political reasons, most famous with the king of Constantinople re-writing the bible so that his politics would be direct from good. Amazing how it all worked out, props to him.
 
Posted by Bryce [Linfield College FTW!!] on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 4:16 PM
[Reply to this


 
wise and compassionate is the ravioli. i try to remember when dealing with religious persons that their comprehensive idiocy is the result of years of training. it takes a great effort to eliminate all trace of reason from one's belief system, and religious persons can succeed in this more than any other monkey descendant. i am glad to hear your friend is still kind and thoughtful, even though he believes you are to burn in hell for all eternity. it is also comforting to know that he, and all others like him, are 100% wrong in their notions of the afterlife. in fact all humans, including the dalai lama, who claim to know what happens after death, are 100% self deluding. the irrefutable fact is that no one knows for sure what will happen when we die. a complete void, all stop? that is possible. reincarnation in some form? that is possible. a heaven with pearly freakin gates complete with giant white man with beard? that too, is possible. not one living human being knows for sure, and every single last human who has ever said they know for sure, is wrong. they may be lying deliberately or they may be deeply self deluding. but there is not one human who knows the answer to this question, until such time as they actually die. thank you for the food for thought, and do enjoy the days we have on this earth. and to all who believe they know what god says, or said, or did or will do, i hope your self delusion brings you some form of happiness. the nature of god is that we do not know the nature of god. i worship the uncertainty, the sweet perfection of our limited knowledge. let there be parmesan.
 
Posted by on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 8:20 PM
[Reply to this
Angela
Angela Plafcan

 
I was just up at Lake Havasu a few weeks ago. Hot as hell. I spent more time at the river, by Parker, AZ. Good times :)
 
Posted by Angela on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 9:39 PM
[Reply to this
Saeed ♫

 
I'm sorry I don't feel you on this one.
I spend Extra energy staying away from my old friends that have "Faith."

They beleve the earth is here for there use. They have fought and killed in the name of that book. they- Don't make me go on rambling becuz I so could :)

Beleving in somthing that tells you to put your head in the sand will train your brain to do the same for things like the destruction of our planet and rights.
Chirstainity isn't just stuped it's dangerous.
 
Posted by Saeed ♫ on Saturday, August 11, 2007 - 10:45 PM
[Reply to this
Saeed ♫

 
Oops I'm err a little "Stupid" myself. Besides my bad spelling you get the point.
 
Posted by Saeed ♫ on Sunday, August 12, 2007 - 7:11 AM
[Reply to this
wh<3t

 
My fiance is an atheist, and I'm a christian... not a fundamentalist christian, i'm a molecular biologist for goodness sake.. I HAVE to believe in evolution, it's in the job description i think... but anyway.

It mostly frustrates me. We mostly just don't talk about it. It mostly entertains him, to get me frustrated. But we can both laugh at family guy/the simpsons. I laugh very hard at people that would rather believe something someone arbitrarily told them, and ignore evidence and facts. so we can both make fun of the hardcore christians out there.

but it does peeve me immensely that he thinks i'm wasting my time and energy by praying. if it makes me feel better, who's business is it but my own??
 
Posted by wh<3t on Monday, August 13, 2007 - 6:04 PM
[Reply to this
Hello Panda!

 
I am currently trying to absorb all the comments and remember what you originally said...

I have a couple of friends (though not close ones) that believe I'm going to hell, and we mostly just don't talk about it. I do find it offensive and disheartening that they could believe this. I don't think I could be best friends or lovers with someone who thought so.

I am theistic Agnostic. I have been as equally offended by certain athiests as by certain fundamentalist christians (which I think is a distinction from many christians, though less often here in "the buckle of the bible belt" aka Oklahoma). I went to church in jr. high out of intense peer pressure, and let them baptise me while my Buddhist mother was out of town. I knew I didn't really believe, but I wanted to listen and learn. Eventually I stopped listening, and instead sat in the balcony writing to myself: lists of spiritual qualities I wanted to exemplify, prayers for others, verses that actually meant something to me. But that was something I could do at home, without being so saddened by the hatred also being taught. Once at a youth conference I was "inspired" by a speech about rampant witchcraft and satanism in high schools. I was "inspired" to get up and speak about judgment, about being someone who DID dress "differently," who was called a witch, a lesbian, and a drug addict (despite my 3.86 gpa and never causing a day of trouble). Luckily the group I'd come with felt strongly about including me and applauded loudly.

For me, most of it comes down to tolerance. To have discussion that involves listening, respecting.... not just anger and condemnation. I had a boyfriend once whose political and worldly beliefs were very different from mine. He accused me of only wanting people around who would agree with me. But my problem wasn't that, it was the WAY our "discussions" went. He treated me like I was stupid - Always interrupting, referring to false authorities and facts he could not prove, laughing in my face. Meanwhile I always tried to listen to his arguments, consider them, and admit when I did not have all the information.

Major points:
1. tolerance and understanding
2. distinction between "christian" and "fundamentalist christian"
3. cannot imagine a CLOSE relationship with someone who thinks me and my kind are going to hell.

PS- I could not send so many good kind souls to hell. My God has to be more rational and kind than I.
 
Posted by Hello Panda! on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 1:31 AM
[Reply to this
Kyle
Kyle Has a inch

 
after being kicked out of almost every high school in the county i was finaly dumped into a christian school. they generaly didnt fuck around about their belifs but i still formed many friendships with people who would be defined as fundamentalists dispite my almost constant slew of inebreated blasphemy. i have found that even some of the most rock ribbed dyed in the wool fundamentalists are a lot more accepting of people then they are given credit for.
 
Posted by Kyle on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 6:39 PM
[Reply to this
Aaron - Random Description

 
i really don't care either way. i am currently non-christian, and am now completely not worrying about spiritual stuff. going to college, focusing on life. my best friend is probably the most christian guy i know, but he's not fundamentalist or anything. just very religious. it seems to me that spiritual beliefs are unimportant as far as friendships go, and that a person's personality are more important than their beliefs. or something.
 
Posted by Aaron - Random Description on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 10:36 PM
[Reply to this
Juno
Jun Pham

 
I could be considered a fundalmentalist christian, I believe the bible is completely true and all that, but all of my closest friends are not, and do not believe in God. Truthfully I don't have that many christian friends. However, my very personality conflicts with what is called the christian norm, seeing as how I am a lieral and a democrat in the bible belt. Another thing is that I am a homosexual, (but not gay, there is a difference...) which definatley conflicts with the whole christian thing. Also , most christians do believe the earth is millions of years old, just the crazy ones think it is only 6000 years.
 
Posted by Juno on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 3:16 AM
[Reply to this
한 홀로

 
I grew up uber-Catholic. I never stopped attending the Catholic Church and didn't think twice about being married in the church. My (now) ex-wfe is still Catholic. Yet, I've been an Atheist for over 15 years. After all those religion and philosophy classes I took (my minor in undergrad) I've come to what I consider to be a very forgiving view of god. The theist believe in a supernatural being who decided to create a universe out of nothing that has become what we see today. Take out the words "supernatural being" and change the word "god" to "mother nature" and we are on the same page. Thinks like "How old is the earth?" or "Do you really think we were evolved from monkeys?" are pointless under those terms. It's how I remain so open minded to anyones alternate beliefs.

Then, when I am among my own kind (atheists and scientists) I drop the gloves and start slinging the fusion of human chromosome 2 and yes, we have created life from nothing in labs for many years. In that world, there is a different standard of "tolerance" required and in that world, it begins and ends with not suffering fools lightly.

It works for me.

When they ask me if I am afraid of god sending me to hell, I typically say that I am probably as worried about that as they are of Zeus sending them to Hades. It usually ends that discussion pretty quickly.
 
Posted by 한 홀로 on Wednesday, October 31, 2007 - 11:14 PM
[Reply to this
SallyBe

 
Amazing. Can't say I've experienced that from family or "friends" that are literal christians.
Father burned my philosophy books when I was 15 and it's been similar experiences ever since. I have found that they "tolerate" outside thinking ONLY IF they are convinced they can bring you into the fold. When they realize that isn't going to happen, it's an ugly thing.
 
Posted by SallyBe on Wednesday, November 14, 2007 - 5:13 PM
[Reply to this


 
He's not a Fundamentalist unless he's changed a lot since I last talked to him. He's a relatively normal Christian.
 
Posted by on Saturday, June 28, 2008 - 5:36 AM
[Reply to this
E GRIZZLE
Enrique Santos

 
My wife is a Christian. I belong to the Church of Realists, who praise only FSM. My wife's family and friends are all devout Christians, while my family and friends are almost exclusively atheists. I am converting most of them to Realists and sreading the holy gospel of FSMism. It is a mutual respect for each others beliefs that makes us work. I think it is because everything else in our relationship is so strong this can be a non factor. I think reality and science has deflated claims made by Christians and The Bible, but I'm not forcing her to change. The only time it becomes an issue is when we talk about how to address this with our children if we have any. Luckily she sees the problem with churches and despises Republicans and Conservatives for the perverting of Christianity. And unlike most Christians, she doesn't use the Bible to justify judgement or discrimination. In fact, she jumped on the computer right after me and said "What is the Flying Spaghetti Monster?" After a brief explanation, I told her to explore the Church of FSM site. She laughed her ass off, especially at the hate mail. I have to say that regardless of our religious differences, we have a great marriage and relationship. May pesto and marinara flow freely upon the pasta that is in the hearts of the people of the world. RAmen
 
Posted by E GRIZZLE on Friday, November 13, 2009 - 4:25 PM
[Reply to this