Straight guys don't get to stand in doorways and threaten someone they THINK isn't another straight guy. Straight guys don't get to harass, torture, annoy and torment others for being gay, trans, gender-variant, or whateve else someone is or presents as. Straight guys can go to hell and stop thinking they run the fucking world.

Bash Back, I wish I had you here. I support your violence. If we can't find safety, we shall MAKE it, and if that involves force, so be it. I <3 Bash Back!
 

youre a fucking idiot joshua. dont waste our time anymore.
 

I agree, clearly he has never been to Spiral OR to Excel where the bathrooms are pretty much unisex. Any time I go to Spiral and use the womyn's bathroom, guys are in there as well.

I don't see any problem with "guys" of any kind in the womyn's room because there are more stalls with curtains or doors and more privacy.

Anyway, I don't know all the correct terminolgy for gender issues but I hope yall get my meaning!
 

The reasons he just pissed me off, was cause for one, obviously we support violence. And I am so tired of people asking that. clearly we do, or we wouldnt have endorsed this. Also he says "people like you make your cause worse", As though he has any fucking clue what our cause is. We dont want tolerance and gay fucking marriage! we want to tear this world of herteronormative control to itsy bitsy pieces! And in the mean time, since we cant seem to even get to shit in safety we have become FED UP! Its too late for tolerance, we want all phobes to have a real reason to fear us! Also what makes me laugh the line about "but at what point do you and others like you take into account how "others" feel?" HAHAHAl WHAT THE FUCK!? good point, maybe dru should have hugged that guy and said, I respect how you feel, Ill get out of your space. Dru should just stop peeing. And the fucking reason womyn dont want traditionally gendered men in the restroom is cause they fucking RAPE. He made his point that he is trans phobic and recognized Dru as female. He simply put himself in there on the bashers side. So he can fuck off.
 

Well, for one, im here to prove some thing to a member of the media here in michigan. that this group is not, and has never been for tolerance. and thank for all for proving my point.. Im also here b/c i believe people can talk about some thing and act as adults and not highschool children.

It is never "too late". Do i agree with the lifestyle? no.. would i advocate assults bc i dont like their lifestyle? no.. Violence against people bc they dont fall in line with you? come on.. this is not a dictatorship. why not try iran???

Im all for people being treated fairly and with respect. but this, your actions, hurts more then it helps. Iv spoken with several groups of people, homosexual, trans, bi, and about 60% believe with actions likes yours, they are MORE in fear then before... when i asked why, one person a trani had this to say... "look at things like this *speaking about the violence* how can i expect people to treat me as i would treat them when every time they see me they wonder if im going to hall off and beat some one up"

you want us to fear you? sorry wont happen. and it wont happen at my church. Were not afraid of you, never have been never will be. Your violence against people, only breeds more violence against people like you.

And I never said any one should hug and make up. i said the guy was wrong to unsult dru.
and umm trani's, homos and lesbians also rape. not just straight men.. please if your going to say some thing like that at least be honest. i understand you like violence but at least be honest. Im sure there has to be some level of maturity or integrity on both our parts. Iv put out there where i stand and iv done it with out insulting you, or your ways or your choices.
 

I don't think you read the story. I understand not being a violent type - I'm really not either.

However, this man stood in front of the door and said "I know you're a bitch" and at some point said "You are about to fight a bitch" (referring to himself).

I realize that you are most likely a straight man and probably don't understand this - but if someone stopped me from getting out of a room and called me a "bitch"; it would be reasonable for me to believe the person was going to try to hurt me. I would be justified in defending myself. I would be justified in hurting the person that was threatening me.

Personally, I would have stopped when the man backed down - but that's my choice. I'm not going to blame "Dru" for violence against "people like" him - like you did. Instead, this man only has himself to blame for starting a fight in a bar. I mean REALLY - how can anyone be fucking amazed that they got hurt when they started a fight?!

Look - I don't live in Lansing and just came across this blog because I was curious about the actions of Bash Back that are being talked about in some of the blogs I frequent. I, personally, tend to avoid violence when I can - however, your take on the situation is just so frighteningly typical. You are blaming individuals for violence against "people like you" - instead of those that ACTUALLY commit the violence against "people like you".

"Dru" (as dispicted in the story) did NOT in any way bring this upon himself. This man deserved to get his ass kicked. We could certainly debate about the severity of the ass kicking - but HE is the one that brought it upon himself.

Honesty - you want honesty! Growing up, the concept of viriginity was so tied to my self-worth due to the conservative teachings of my church and the norms of the rural culture I lived in - that I seriously considered if I would rather be murdered or raped. I considered if I would rather kill myself than allow someone to rape me. Truth or no truth - girls are taught to fear men. Girls are taught to remain in fear of rape - avoiding walking alone, locking car doors the moment they get in, taking self-defense classes, carrying pepper spray -

DO YOU DO ANY OF THOSE THINGS?! No?

Honesty? You live in a fantasy world.

Women parade around with signs "Stop the Violence" - and I think they have it all wrong. You can't empower yourself by pleading with someone else to PLEASE stop! You have to make them stop.

Exactly HOW you do that - we can have a great ethical debate. However, you're going to have to get with reality before having an HONEST discussion.
 

This is the first time I have read the Bash Back! myspace, and though I am generally a peacenik, I do accept that sadly, sometimes, violence is the only way to make someone else listen.  That isn't going to change. 

Sinmantyx, your reply to Joshua is brilliant and beautifully put.  I second your statements on girls being schooled as children to fear boys and men.  That fear is powerful and terrible- it is also horrid that they have a reason to fear in the first place (because some men really are that wicked). 

I commend Dru for standing up for himself and fighting back.  It isn't easy to do that sometimes, but unless we all stand strong and stand up for what we are and what we believe in (however we express that), we end up invisible and walked over.


 

hey can we print this response? Its really articulate and would like to put it in a zine.
If so, how would you like us to credit you?
 

I don't know what the fuck Josh is doing here. This is a place for friends.

Peaceful protest is all well and good, but sometimes you gotta go out and fuck shit up. If I can ever get out of my psycho Christian school for a night, maybe we'll run into each other at Spiral or something.
 

fuck yeah i remember  your black eye from that night but he was a mess good job
 

fuck yeah! mad props for kicking that creeps ass [balls]!