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Illseed



Last Updated: 7/15/2009

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Status: Single
City: NEWARK
State: Delaware
Country: US
Signup Date: 3/5/2006
Friday, August 18, 2006 

Current mood:  accomplished
So, I got accused of racism AGAIN? why can't a guy mention a race-related issue with out being called racist? I'm not even about that anymore. I'm about working with ppl that are about working for the betterment of man. read below. his letter and my reply.

On 8/17/06, T L <@gmail.com> wrote:

Ok, here we go!! You stated that you are not convinced that it was an honest mistake that two Marines depcited in the film as white was not correct. The Marine did not come to light until 5 years later. Why now? Why not a long time ago? I mean if he was truly a hero he would have revealed himself, if not then then why wait until a movie is made. See the things that irritate me about race and color is it seems a lot more colored people are racist than whites now. It seems as of years of feelings from colored people regarding racism is now turing into them being racists and not white people anymore. I am a white guy with a lot of black friends and we talk about this all the time. Nothing is owed to the people of NOW, they were not affected by things that happened a long time ago, so why are the feelings of mistakes by white people held to such a degree of hate and it does not allow anyone to move forward. If you think about it its always like you dont know how we feel, you are not in our shoes, etc.... Well shit goes both ways. When I go to an area that is mostly colored the way a lof of colored people feel when they are not in a comfort zone, I feel out there. Now I am no punk and maybe people can see that in my swagger so that is usually why I get love and dont get jumped this in that. Or for example people make fun of whites and I crack up and if its turned around, then dudes a racist or some BS. They take it too far. I mean there is BET (Black Entertainment TV) Now imagine a WET for White Entertainment TV, that would be considered the most racist tv station ever. Or at schools there is BSU (Black Student Union), now again WSU would never be allowed. There are all black colleges and a lot of things labeled BLACK. Now you being a smart person and I am sure you can think from both sides, tell me does that seem right. Does it seem right that White people get so called punked, made fun of, etc and if the tables were turned then the white person did something wrong. I just feel that a comment like that one is not right. No one fucking came fwd until the movie was made. Should I say hey he only did that so he can get money or some tish, no thats not cool. This might be considered a white movie or whatever but movies that are considered black movies only have whites in there to make fun or or to look bad, if any are even in it. So think about both sides before making a comment like yours. Lets see if this shit gets posted, word for word too.

TL

I RESPONDED...

lol...did you call Black people "colored?"

What is your point? When you are making a movie about a historic event such as 9/11, accuracy is vital, key and very important to the core to the credibility of the film. You appear overly emotional over this topic of race. I didn't attempt to exaggerate the matter nor did I raise a ruckus. I posed a question and a comment. You said this, "I mean if he was truly a hero he would have revealed himself, if not then then why wait until a movie is made." I don't know how old you are, but I would guess that you are roughly 16-17 - maybe 18. The man saw the movie and saw himself depicted as a white male, a sentiment echoed in the yahoo article and he then came forward. Jason Thomas a hero whether or NOT he appears in a movie, whether or not he receives credit from people like you. He left his home, put on a Marine suite and ran up to the falling towers. HERO. The first sentence of the story says they have been looking for him, but somehow they couldn't find him like Bin Laden.

Now, nobody made mention of racism. That was you. But, since you brought it up, allow me to reply. First of all racism represents an equation of POWER plus BIOTRY. So, Black people can be bigots and prejudiced as Whites, but unless you can oppress and halt a race's forward progress, you aren't a racist. Also, let us understand much of the so-called bigotry of Black people is rooted in a legacy of slavery, violent race-based acts and oppression for several centuries. WET TV is NBC, ABC, CBS and Spike. There is virtually no programming for African Americans. WB Network did have Black folk, but most of it was so bad and buffoonish that I couldn't tolerate it. See, a White person can go on the Apollo and get more love than a Black person...that's how much of a loving, caring people us "colored" folks are. As for you, since you have so many "colored" friends, I recommend you go back and read the intimate details of our history in America and outside of America.

PS: Don't ever use the word "colored" again unless you mean crayons or something.
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Tiffani

 
I'm glad you posted his email word for word as he asked.  It's really hard to edit ignorance!
 
Posted by Tiffani on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:22 AM
[Reply to this
DJ Main Event // Low-Cost CD/DVD Duplication!

 
i still think race should be a non-issue in this day and age. we humans, breathe the same air, and bleed the same way. there's more important topics worth being dealt with out there anyway.

for one, which REALLY came first, chicken or egg?

i jest. but you get my point.

 
Posted by DJ Main Event // Low-Cost CD/DVD Duplication! on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:26 AM
[Reply to this
AnoNyMO CONsejo

 

DJ MAIN EVENT even in this day and age.  You must be smoking some good crack.  Just a few tidbits to think about.

1) In major urban centers gentrification is going on ,in NY alone, an article in the Times said the "educated" population went up about 25%.  Forcing real estate prices to go up, forcing out the working class and urban poor in communities where minorities mostly black and brown ppl live. 

Oh yeah 1 in every 2 black men has a criminal record just about....so what do these educated neo urbanites look like?  And why do they outnumber ppl that look like me and my Latin cousins in a place like NY with a minority population that outnumbers the majority from bumsfuck, newly moved to the city?

2)  President Bush's handling of Katrina...if that were Beverly Hills would you really have seen bodies floating in the street?  The moment an earthquake or forest fire happens in Calif. you have the National Guard out there with Firejumpers quelching a blaze or rescuing a baby.  You can get relief halfway across the world for a tsunami but you it's to difficult to send trucks to the Bayou!

Be smart...it's hidden under the vail of socio-economic status now but still all and all it's largely racism.

3) DUMB WHITE GUY BECOMES PRESIDENT, DOES HORRIBLE, AND KEEPS HEAVY APPROVAL RATINGS A QUARTER INTO A NEW EVEN MORE HORRIBLY CONCEIVED 2ND TERM.  Only now are some ppl admitting that he sucks a donkey's dick.  And then his base that elected him is still backing him?! You dont' find that strange.  Please believe it believe it pls if your (excuse me but sometimes vulgarity is the abbrassive to clean life's bullshit) black ass thinks that you could be elected, do so poorly, and still be so beloved...let alone make it to the second term...well you are in serious denial.

Look at David Dinkins, first and only black mayor of NY EVER.  He's never been Mayor again tell you that much.  He didn't do a horrible job but he didn't have the infrastructure as the first black mayor ever, ppl often worked against him and so alot of the beneficial things he did never saw the light of day under his adminstration...but yet white ppl would have you believe that he was horrible, while Guiliani rode in afterwards and reaped alot of the credit for initiatives that Dinkins wanted, but did not have the political clout and connections that come with being White.

 

SYNOPSIS: USE YOUR HEAD FOR MORE THAN A HAT RACK!!!

I'm not saying be closed to life's diversity, but aren't you as being as equally closed to deny it's injustice as well.....?


 
Posted by AnoNyMO CONsejo on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:09 PM
[Reply to this
DJ Main Event // Low-Cost CD/DVD Duplication!

 
who said i was closed to it? i see and go through life's bullshit and injustices on a DAILY basis. could make a lifetime of books out of it.

and before you go on the offensive, use your mouth for something other than a toilet that works backwards. all im saying is that there are bigger issues @ hand. not that this is a non-issue, but excuse me if im looking @ things  in  a worldwide sense.

 
Posted by DJ Main Event // Low-Cost CD/DVD Duplication! on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:56 PM
[Reply to this


 
WOW!!! COLORED? This guy sent this letter to you? He's bold. And I wonder how his black friends feel about him using the word  "colored".
 
Posted by on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:26 AM
[Reply to this
breakdownbeats

 
Can't we all get along.  I mean really.  Is this the most important topic to be discussed about the movie?  In the face of what happened that day, and what is going on now. There are bigger issues.
 
Posted by breakdownbeats on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:26 AM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
i actually get along with everybody. i'm not sure what you mean, but to answer your question NO. there is war all over the place. people have no respect for themselves or others. i would have to answer that witha  firm no.

i certainly champion PEACE.

 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:35 AM
[Reply to this
breakdownbeats

 

My point was this.  They never really knew who the hero was.  He just came out recently.  So it was an oversight.  Was it intentional, who can say it was or was not.  Debating it is pointless.  Will all that happened in that movie, for you to pick that one thing out and mention it is shoddy to me.  Its like a dude with a paper cut in the emergency room crying in front of someone that just got run over by a car. feel me.  There are way bigger issues in that movie than what you mentioned.  

And I too really really enjoy your blog and the all hip hop site.  When I first read what you wrote on your rumour section, I thought to myself, "Is that all he got out of it?" 

People do respect themselves and other people.  Just look around.


 
Posted by breakdownbeats on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 6:46 AM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
u know what? what is important to YOU and me are 2 very different things. I'd like to know and see a BLACK person being portrayed as a hero at 9/11. period. I find it interesting that this isnt important to you. it was important enuff for yahoo, the associated press and all other media to cover it, but not important for me to discuss. get out of here with that. thats luda like the rapper. u must jest.

i've talked about 9/11 plenty and this movie is nothing but propaganda..thats whats important for people to know. but u should know my thoughts on that. i havent even seen it, but i've seen "loose change" and "11 unanswered questions abut 9/11" and other stuff that critically takes the event to task.

oliver stone or no, a black dude left home and went to to the gates of hell - willingly. black kids need to see that and be proud of it.

i assume you are not black and so that may not be important to u, but to me and others it is. they couldnt find him? i just dont buy it.
 
Posted by Illseed on Saturday, August 26, 2006 - 7:56 PM
[Reply to this
Tynisa Colleen

 

wow... and none of his so called friends have checked him on calling us "colored"? whatever...


 
Posted by Tynisa Colleen on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:29 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
I feel like everyone is ignoring the most basic fact about this whole situation: if you read the article, it becomes clear that they did not even know the identity of Sgt. Thomas until AFTER the movie was made.

I usually agree with the majority of your points, but this one really is POINTLESS, considering that the guy himself says he didn't even know they were looking for him until he saw the movie.

It was the fact that you cockily asserted "coincidence? I think not", as if every situation like this is OBVIOUSLY racism, when you are talking about notorious liberal filmmaker Oliver Stone, that probably got most people upset with you.

I love your blog (I am a subscriber), especially the one you did on Busta being the King of NYC, but in this case you jumped the gun and pulled the race card. You gotta be careful doing that because it can get to be a boy cried wolf situation (like how Cynthia McKinney lost much of her credibility with her conspiracy rant in Washington DC earlier this year)

Like I said, if you had taken more time to read the article you listed as the source, you would have realize that it couldn't have been a deliberate omission because they didn't even know who the guy was till afterwards.

Long and short of it: Does Hollywood frequently shortchange African Americans? Yes. Was this one of those times? Definitly not.

Thats my 2 cents
Tommy

 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:37 AM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
but, my thing is this: the dude saw himself in the movie. they admittted to looking for the guy. i never said that it was racist, but by default they made it a white dude. why not a black fellow by default or an asian or a mexican or puerto rican.

i never pulled any race card...for goodness sake, i just liked to a story on yahoo. that dude called my people colored. LOL.

come on man.

 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:39 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

but, my thing is this: the dude saw himself in the movie. they admittted to looking for the guy. i never said that it was racist, but by default they made it a white dude. why not a black fellow by default or an asian or a mexican or puerto rican.

so its ok to replace the black guy other races but its racist to replace him with a white guy.  Insecure??  This blog wouldnt exist had he been a hispanic but since he was white, people take such offense. Sensitive??


 
Posted by Matt on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 6:23 AM
[Reply to this
Allow me to reintroduce myself
ryan cannatella

 

I think the point he was making  was that not just that dude was white, but why couldn't he have at least been a minority. I don't necessarily agree tho, they didn't  know what race he was. So, they took a guess.

But, if they did make him some other race, and he actually was white, you know how that would go down.


 
Posted by Allow me to reintroduce myself on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 2:24 PM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
Illseed,

Look man, the reason why I said you pulled the race card is because you made a big deal that this wasn't a coincidence, when obviously it was.

I am not saying you are a racist, I am not saying that I can't see your point of view. I also am DEFINITLY not defending this guys use of the word colored.

But when you state that it is not a coincidence, alluding to some kind of backroom conspiracy, make sure you are doing that in a case where you can be reasonably sure that is the case.

-Tommy

 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:00 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
One additional thing: I feel, in my opinion, that you let yourself off easy with your equation for what racism is.

Simply put, racism = bigotry. If you are a bigot, you are racist. If you judge peoples actions or abilities by their race or background, you are racist. Power has nothing to do with it. Racism is about belief, not ability to utilize that belief. Bigotry or Ignorance plus Power = OPPRESSION.

Racism is anytime you judge a group of people, negatively or positively, by race. The same way classism is when you judge a group of people, negatively or positively, by their socioeconomic class.

Don't pretend that an oppressed person can't be racist. That is ridiculous!

For the record, here is Websters definition of racism:
racÂism   (rszm)
n.
()
  1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability


 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:43 AM
[Reply to this
Jrean'ne

 

dude seriously, please dont give quotes from websters dictionary ever again.

Reason: they have altered the definitions of alot of words in recent years. dont believe me??? cross reference the definition of the word "nigger" with a few different dictionaries and you will see exactly what i mean!!!

as far as the rest of your comment. that is between u and illseed. But please dont use websters.

oh wait let me correct myself. its Merriam-websters. If u check the old websters dictionary then its a different story.


 
Posted by Jrean'ne on Wednesday, August 30, 2006 - 12:37 AM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
are u serious? are u serious?
The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability

i know you like the blog and all that, respect due. but with all due respect, you and  i come from 2 very different walks of life. i have witnessed racism head on and they didnt mention our differences...it was more like, HATE.

prejudice and bigotry isnt synonymous to racism...if they were theyd be the same word. there is a power component to racism. the ability to oppress a group of people based on their race.

ie the systematic oppression of Black/African American people since slavery. period.

i mean, this really isnt where i wanted this conversation to go, but it seems that white people are very preoccupied with making sure that blacks can be racisted too...rather than checkin if THEY are racist. i'm not colored, dude.


 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:53 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
First of all, I would say I do have atleast a good deal of insight into the hatred you speak of.

The following isnt't to brag, only to provide context:
My entire life I grew up in schools where I was the minority. As such, I was treated as the minority. I was frequently beat up in elementary school for being white, frequently called slave master and cracker by kids my own age.

Since deciding to be apart of hip-hop, which I realize is a decision (you never made a decision to be discriminated against, I did, I accept that), in 98, I have on a weekly basis been attacked in one form or another for my color. I have been treated like I didn't belong, have been isolated and ignored, and generally hated. To continue, to perservere, especially considering I was battling, I on a regular basis did AND continue to run into racism head on. Not just from African-Americans, but also from whites who do not accept me for what I do.

Once again, you are assuming your life has been much harder than mine, something that honestly you have no right to do considering you don't know me.

Let me close this by saying I agree with your last statement: Right now too many whites focus on the racism of others as a way of excusing and distracting themselves from their own hate. But, even though that is a fact, that doesn't make it safe to assume that I am one of those whites.

As I said, racism is belief. Discrimination is the action associated with racism. Just like religion and worship are different words. If you look closely, racism is a belief that people are inferior or superior based on race, discrimination is what happens if you are given the power to do something about that.

 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:08 AM
[Reply to this
breakdownbeats

 

Actually he is right.  When you add power into racism its called discrimination.


 
Posted by breakdownbeats on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:46 AM
[Reply to this
Just Livin My Life

 

It's amazing how how he never saw how racist he sounds. "Colored" you gotta be kidding me right........This is 2006 and white people still don't get it......Why do they try to compare their "struggles" with what we have faced? It will never be a comparison. Ignorance is all through his email and it's said if he does have black friends......Luckly for him, this wasn't a face to face discussion.......WET TV how dare you...........Black colleges are kidding me........Count the number of HBCU in the world and then count the others...come on now....I went to a HBCU and the white people were given far better scholarships with lower requirements than I would have received if I would have went to a USC(Which I was excepted to but chose a HBCU instead) This guy has got to be playing because if not someone really needs to educate him before he gets himself hurt talking crazy


 
Posted by Just Livin My Life on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:47 AM
[Reply to this
Just Livin My Life

 
Okay I know I just left a comment , but in my writing the last one more comments popped up and I have have to say once again Cluleless...... One comment mentioned what he said about not knowing they were looking for him.......That could mean that no one tried which is why he didn't know......Remember there was another marine with him... These two men dug for hours to help the trapped officers.....They communicated with each other and you mean to tell me that the producers had no way of finding out that one of the marines who risk their life was Black.......Question: Why wasen't the other marine asked about the mystery man? and If he was , why wasen't he able to identify a man whom he risk his life with as a Black man........Many black people are upset at this situation and for some people to down play it like it's an over reaction is sad.......It's nice that you know the text book defintion of rascim........But you will never really understand.
 
Posted by Just Livin My Life on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 1:59 AM
[Reply to this
Saul T.C. Waters

 

coincidence or not it happened...and the issue is the context in which it happened.

this isnt a minor event --its something that has changed america as we know it and redefined race and class boundaries that were still there but harder to see (for some) before 9/11. i dont care if its oliver stone or melvin van peebles...if you're going to recount history as a film maker its your responsiblity to do so correctly.

as black people we cant help but notice we get written out of world history by american and european authors . in the past we didnt have a means to contest or petition but when shit pops off now it WILL be checked.

 you can blow the wide nostril nose off hiram akhet (the sphinx)... you can exclude the slave trade from h.s. and jr. high world history books ...and you can change a black sgt into a white pvt for your WTC movie...but dont expect it to go unnoticed and know i aint payin to see that shit


 
Posted by Saul T.C. Waters on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:21 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

In making this statement, I am in no way trying to appear racist or make your point seem trivial.  I am only trying to better my knowledge since I was raised by history books that exluded blacks from history books.

In my schooling we learned about their struggles in the segregation days and in the civil rights era, we learned how they were stolen from their homeland and enslaved.  A war was waged, in part, to liberate the slaves. And who lost his own life to ensure it happened? Abe Lincoln. We learned about Booker T and GW Carver and Frederick Douglas and harriet Tubman and Beecher Stowe.    We learned more detailed fact during February.

And before blacks came to america, what sort of contributions did they make to grand scheme of world history.  And what did my history books go out of there way to exlcude?


 
Posted by Matt on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 5:12 AM
[Reply to this
~*~Kelly Kel~*~

 

 

"We learned about Booker T and GW Carver and Frederick Douglas and harriet Tubman and Beecher Stowe.    We learned more detailed fact during February."

okay ....you want to see the problem....this is part of it...you named 5 black americans who contributed....there were thousands...why dont we hear about that? did you know that the man who invented the traffic light and the gas mask was black? why don't we know their names...

and why not get more detail in freakin october or march....it is almost an insult to have february as "black history month"...but since black history seems to be excluded all other 11 months of the year it is necessary.

and that is the problem. IGNORANCE. most people have no clue, black americans helped build this country---this world. and the sad thing is--most people dont want to know. they dont want to know that what they have learned is untrue or i should say incomplete.


 
Posted by ~*~Kelly Kel~*~ on Sunday, August 20, 2006 - 2:45 PM
[Reply to this
Rudy

 

kelly, I agree with the fact blacks helped build this country,but so did many other

      oppressed people, namely chinese, japanese , native americans,etc,and they

        don't have  a fill in the blank history month. many races have all made

          contributions.


 
Posted by Rudy on Tuesday, August 29, 2006 - 8:31 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

Thats interesting, but it isnt really necessary to include in history books.  I mean, I dont recall learning who built the first computer or who invented the rifle or who invented any number of things.  Maybe the inventor of the gas mask and traffic light were left out of history books because it isnt signifigant in the grand scheme of things.   We learn of GW Carver for his contributions in farming, the same goes for Eli Whitney.  History book teaches us about Ben Franklin and Edison Lewis Latimer and Elijah McCoy (black men) and Henry Ford and the 'printing press guy'  because their ideas were revolutionary and had greater impact. 

Its impossible to include all inventions of all blacks and all whites.  I dont think the fact that contributions made by whites outnumber those of blacks involves any bit of racism.  Most educated people realize and respect what blacks have contributed to this nation, and I dont respect anyone who thinks otherwise.


 
Posted by Matt on Sunday, August 20, 2006 - 5:41 PM
[Reply to this
Meach aka J.Gatsby

 
holy fucking shit. what contributions did blacks make to the world. well before we came to american we were african. and africa is the birthplace of the human species. the birthplace of civilization. the birthplace of education and culture. the first formal society was born in africa. the pyramids and the sphinx are in africa. the gold and diamonds that the european craved so much were in africa. all the greek philosophers were taught in egypt. not greece and rome. and all that is in your history books matty. the greates military leader in the history of the world was black also. it wasn't alexander, or julius ceaser, or napoleon, or jitler, or chuchill, or bush, or ghengis khan. it was hannibal. and that is in your history books also brother. and when i say brother i mean it, because no matter what we are all from the same place and we are all the same species. peace.
 
Posted by Meach aka J.Gatsby on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 4:07 PM
[Reply to this
~*~Kelly Kel~*~

 

exactly. i have a theory....(blending my text book knowledge with my bible knowledge...)okay we (as in the human race) began in Africa! And I think the differences came with the Tower of Babel. We were trying to build a tower into the heavens and God said .."oh heck nah" go to the four corners of the world, we couldn't communicate, we had different laguages...our skin changed due to different climatic conditions....We are all human. We all come from the same place.

And I would like to say that racism is very tricky...in the fact that people(more so white people) are TRAINED NOT TO SEE IT. we have to open eyes here people. The normal white, middleclass, man cant SEE RACISM. (now by normal..i mean that white dude you work with that has no discrimination problems, buys you a beer in the bar, but will tell you why he buys you the beer..."yeah man, i got 5 black friends and i got no problems with black folks") okay. this guy seems okay, has no HATE in his heart for different races but cant see that by NOT acknowledging racism he is in fact contributing to racism. White folks have to be awakened to the fact that yeah we got WET tv....all TV is WET (white entertainment television). We have special foundations for young black americans because the scales are not even and steps have to be taken to FORCE them to be even. Now the day we turn on NBC and we see a show like Friends on at 7 and then Girlfriends comes on at 730 and then George Lopez's show at 8 then we can yell.."there should be no BET." but until then...that is the way it has to be.

 


 
Posted by ~*~Kelly Kel~*~ on Sunday, August 20, 2006 - 2:14 PM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
AMEN!

this is exactly what i wanted to convey.
WE HAD A HERO AT WTC. LET THE WORLD KNOW IT! its always an innocent error when we get written out of the history books/films.

if you couldnt find a key person, you keep looking, it aint hard. Put an ad in the NY TIMES. interview witnesses. The post, the Daily news.

its like when they labled the black ppl "looters" at the whites as "findings things"
then we are pulling a race card.

i'm saying man, the civil rights movment was in the 60s and early 70s....thats like 40 years ago. not long enuff.


 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:44 AM
[Reply to this
THANH IS NOW OFFICIALY GOING TO JAPAN IN AUGUST!!!
Thanh Tran

 

hmMm...the link on the rumor page foes not bring me to this page hahaha i had to go to your page but anyway T L <@gmail.com> kwazy!!!


 
Posted by THANH IS NOW OFFICIALY GOING TO JAPAN IN AUGUST!!! on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:49 AM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
thx for finding me haha
 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:07 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
Tiffany said:
"It's nice that you know the textbook definition of racist"

"Why do they try to compare their "struggles" with what we have faced?"

Heri Huevos said:
"coincidence or not it happened . . .and know i aint payin to see that shit"

Allow me to briefly respond to these comments. If you respond as well, then I will write more. As it is, both of you seem pretty close minded, so I am not sure your replies will contain any more substance than what you have already said.

First of all, to Heri Huevos:
So you are saying that, whether it was a coincidence, you still won't see it? So even if it was a coincidence, you won't see it? Nice to see that individuals other than George Dubya and Bill O'Reilly don't need facts to make opinions.

You are comparing Napoleon's purposeful destruction of the Ancient Sphinx to an accidental omission in a Hollywood movie by a notorious activist and liberal movie maker? A man who has made numerous movies that touch on the idea of racism and hatred?

PLEASE DO YOUR RESEARCH. This goes back to the Boy Who Cried Wolf thing like I said earlier.. Yes Racism exists, and it needs to be pointed out where it does. But when you point out racism EVEN WHERE IT DOESN'T EXIST, it invalidates your other claims. In other words, when you mix in ignorant facts with truthful facts (like mixing a hollywood omission with information about the slave trade), it makes you look uneducated. Since I work hard to expose the fact that racism is still alive (I help teach at local public schools and alternative schools), since I view racism as one of the great evils of mankind, it frustrates me when people discredit my views by not doing their research and by stating ignorant claims.

Second of all, to Tiffany:
First of all, you are right Tiffany, it is nice that I know the textbook definition of a word. You know why? Cause when you debate about what a word means, it helps if you know the definition. So yes, I brought up the definition of racism to combat the idea that illseed thought he wasn't being racist just because he was being oppressed. I disagreed with his viewpoint, carefully read what he said, and responded respectfully and after doing my research. It is called respectful debate. You should try it sometime.

Secondly, let's talk about your comment about how "noone knows what its like." Yes because no race in history has had to endure what . ..  oh wait what about the Jewish race . . . oh wait what about the Native Americans . . . oh wait what about the indigenous people of Australia? What about the Irish people under the British empire? What about the last 200 years of treatment of the Mexican people? What about ANYONE who lived in the Phillipenes during Teddy Roosevelt's horrible career as general or president.

The fact of the matter is, I have the right to my opinions whether or not people in my past were oppressed. I dont have to prove myself worthy to have opinions on racism. I don't have to compare my history to yours, and honestly, it wouldn't matter if I did, because even then my ancestors have had their fair share of hardtimes, oppression, rape, racism.

One of the main problems with your point of view is a sense of entitlement. Yes, horrible wrongs were enacted over centuries onto an innocent people. Yes, racism still lingers and limits the lives of good African-American people. Yes, this is wrong. But when you, and I mean the two of you specifically, choose to remain willfully ignorant, and to constantly remind others that you have been treated worse than any other race in history, then even people in the status quo who are symphatic to the plight eventually feel that we are not needed, not wanted, and worst of all, we feel stupid for wanting to help.

2 more cents. Here is hoping you read what I wrote, respond to my points, and that we can get a dialogue going.

Thanks,
Tommy



 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:53 AM
[Reply to this
Saul T.C. Waters

 

T. Valentine

If you think movies arent a major component in the view people have of history you're playing yourself. I'm not going to go into how closed minded you seem...cuz you seem like an intelligent cat who wants to make a difference (i.e. you responding to 100 folks in one blog). Just know that most people dont read to get true historical accounts of what happened. The avg american sees a movie and allows that to become thier reality. Entertainment at the cost of 1/2 truth is dangerous (off top I'm thinkin Liz Taylor as Cleopatra and Mel Gibson's Passion).

 I try to stay up on the accomplishments and plights of people around the world b/c it interests me. When I see something in movies (like this  one about to come out) I question it and want to get different perspectives so that I know the facts. My only point was whether its purposeful or not, the true identity of sgt thomas should be clarified.

 

Illseed I'm glad  you posted this b/c TL and others like him really dont get it. I dont want your sympathy or assistance. I just want the same opportunities as the next man and a school for my kids to go to where they wont be lied to or treated like inmates.


 
Posted by Saul T.C. Waters on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 12:17 PM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
Respect on this response. 
 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Sunday, August 20, 2006 - 1:40 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 
uh...THE PASSION OF THE CHRIST was most def historically accurate
 
Posted by Matt on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 12:02 PM
[Reply to this
Illseed

 
u kinda made sense here...only thing is, much of your arguement is on sand. i dont play the "who got oppressed more game"
i just rep for what i know. as i  see it, nobody runs stuff more than jews except maybe gays. they rock.
black people have to work things out internally and then nothing external can fuck with that. thats me. nobody can fuck with illseed right now. i'm too good, BUT a lotta ppl cant say the same and they are mentally brainwashed and conditioned to kill each other, hate each other and all that other good stuff systematic racism does.

i gotta give america credit...like, they got us good to the point where they dont have to do a lot. we do the work for them. so, yeah, blacks are racists...they  are racists to other black people.

 
Posted by Illseed on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:05 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
Illseed,

Glad to see we are agreeing here on atleast some points. Sorry to see my argument was on sand. Ha. And for the record, I wasn't accusing YOU of the who got oppressed more game. That was pointed squarely at the individuals I listed. If I thought you were that ignorant, I wouldn't be subscribed here, and wouldn't read the website so regularly.

Let me respond to one thing though:
First of all, yes Jewish-Americans have a good deal of influence in the financial sector. But hopefully one day African-Americans will have a similar claim in society. I would love to see that. However, when that happens, will that remove the fact that America treated you wrong? No. Then to the same degree, recognize that simply because Jewish people are doing well now, that doesnt mean they didnt' suffer in the past.

I agree that internal changes should be made before external changes can count. You can see that was the case in the case of Chinese workers in this country, Irish Americans, Italian Americans, and now Mexican Americans. Obviously the damage done against African-Americans was far more brutal, so there is more work to help. Just remember that even Malcolm X eventually realized that outside help can be a good thing. And remember that some of us want to provide that help.

-Tommy

 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:21 AM
[Reply to this
kate
Kate T

 
colored? someone is stuck in the past and its a damn shame too.

the black guy that came out five years later, imo, probably went thru something after saving those men's lives. that can have emotional effects on someone. seeing the previews of that movie helped him see that he is a hero. who kno?

 
Posted by kate on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 2:59 AM
[Reply to this
breakdownbeats

 
real hero's are mostly unknown.  They don't grab the spotlight after doing something.  Thats why they never found him.  He did what he did and walked away.  Amazing.  Most people can't live up to that standard.  There are only a small %. 
 
Posted by breakdownbeats on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 7:25 AM
[Reply to this
Tommy Valentine

 
Jesse,

I agree with everything you said here.

The only thing I would add however, is that it is in the nature of ALL men to be weak and greedy. I believe only those of us like ourselves, people that analyze and challenge ourselves and society, have the chance to be better.

To say that it is in the nature of white's to be evil, one has to specify what white means. Does that mean anyone with fair skin? What about whites that were isolated away from the AngloSaxons when they fought the Crusades? Are they still responsible for the Crusades? I think to say that whites are the most evil race, is the same thing as crediting all asians with the accomplishments of the Koreans, or the Japanese, or the Chinese. Or crediting all African Americans with the work of Benjamin Banneker.

Simply put, selfish people make selfish decisions. The majority of people in America are white, so the majority of selfish examples will be white. Its mathematics.

That said, I agree with you that the system is unfair. I agree with you it is criminal. I ESPECIALLY AGREE WITH YOU THAT THE DEATH PENALTY SYSTEM IS BULLSHIT! But whether or I agree or not, pointing out that whites are more evil than any other race, and that blacks have been more persecuted solves nothing.

-Tommy

 
Posted by Tommy Valentine on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 3:15 AM
[Reply to this
Sikk Caden (Hasnt Forgotten About Sean Bell)

 
i can honestly say youve never said anything even remotely racist in my opinion.
 
Posted by Sikk Caden (Hasnt Forgotten About Sean Bell) on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 4:13 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

Blacks cant be racist b/c they dont suppress another race? Well, although affirmative action was an idea of Pres. Nixon, the fact remains that it is an institution that blacks deem necessary and fair, but it still benefits minorities and hurts other races, therefore showing the power of the race. 

Look at the Duke situation.  A team was forced to quit its season and a coach lost his job all because a black hooker, I mean exotic dancer, claimed the boys raped her.  The black community demanded action be taken against the school and the team and as a result the whites on the team were 'suppressed' due to the power of blacks.

I could offer further examples but I dont really have the energy to do so, but no one can deny that the black community and its leaders have enormous power over our society, and its lazy to think otherwise.

So, if you say blacks are not racist b/c they dont have power, then you are just wrong.

And why dont more black leaders condemn the use of the "race card" that the blacks play so often??


 
Posted by Matt on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 4:53 AM
[Reply to this
Devon

 

Matt,

Let me start by saying that I respect you opinion, but you really need to be schooled.  First of all, anyone can be racist, whether black or white or yellow or brown. Racism is not exclusive to just whites, but all inclusive to all races.

Next, Affermative action was developed because white america did not want blacks in america to move ahead and have any success(Oppression). As far the situation at Duke University, did you really find it necessary to describe the young lady as a Black Hooker?  I wonder if you would have described her this way had she been white.  Neither one of us were there so we dont really know what happened, and I for one will not speculate. If you think that we as Blacks have power you are Dead Wrong!!!  As far as you statement concerning NFL and Black coaches, I believe that the NFL did the right thing, or do you not feel we are only good for the entertainment but not for running the teams? I wonder??? 


 
Posted by Devon on Friday, August 25, 2006 - 10:45 PM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

Sorry, I should have just called her a black stripper, its not something you can sugar coat.

Whatever the motivation for Affirmative Action was, the fact remain, it is here and it gives some bit of power to minorities, not just blacks.

The NFL is dead wrong for their policy that a team must at least interview a minority.   For example, the Cowboys really wanted Parcells and no one else.  They should be allowed to interview him and sign him to a contract instead of putting on some dog and pony show that shows the NFL is committed to diversity.  Its a waste for everyones time that the team interview a person who has no chance of getting the job


 
Posted by Matt on Saturday, August 26, 2006 - 3:40 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 
oh yeah and the nfl's rule that teams must interview a black coach also illustrates their power
 
Posted by Matt on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 12:10 PM
[Reply to this
Animaniac

 
Yawn. Okay....so you're saying that us complaining about historical accuracy and the fact that by default unless specified, everyone shall be casted as white isn't an issue. Okay, the Duke situation...I bet if the chic were white..similar actions would be taken. They're still wrong for raping a female. But I'm tired, so I'm just going to say this "hush." I'm certain you have your own problems that you think are far more important than what we're discussing so go ahead and deal with those. Thank you for your comment though! I'm certain it'll add some fuel to the fire.
 
Posted by Animaniac on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 5:20 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

 the NBA, a sport i love, is being flushed down the toilet by the influx of streetballers and idiots like artest and jermaine oniel. I should email stern.  And guys like Bruce Bowen and Kirk Heinrich get no love.

And my tax money may pay for slave reparations.

And I may lose a job to another applicant simply because the company needed to reach its minority quota


 
Posted by Matt on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 5:56 AM
[Reply to this
Charles Albert Green
Charles Green

 

How many BLACK owners are there in the leagues. How many Black coaches are given third and fourth chances. Shit, Notre Dame alone should proove my point. Weiss is getting credit for Willinghams recruits. As for STREET BALLERS: Dr. J was a street baller, Lou Al Cinder played street ball. Artest can actually shoot and plays d. Captain Kurt has NO dee. Micheal Jordan talked the most shit on the court in his day!! But since he never took a stand in terms of race(Ask Craig Hodges) he got love and t.v. burn. If it wasn't for street ballers, theirs no 3 pt. line, and no dunking. Blame the owners for paying millions to underqualified players. Is Jason Williams of the Miami heat a race trader to you? Do you not like the Professor? Since Pistol Pete could cross over and pass behind his back does that make him a bad player? True street baller can play ball period. A under-developed player is just that.

And can people stop saying Abe freed the slaves!! In legal terms the Emancipation Proclamation is a CONTRIBAND act, just like the legislature he pushed before it. THE DARK AGES were when EUROPEAN SOCIETY was in decline. Without MINORITYS working for FREE your state wouldn't be cultivated. The cotton from southren plantations was used to trade with other nations. So a little tax to pay back the ancestors of slaves should be a small price to pay.

 

P.S. Who knows that the first American to die in our war for independace(from britain) was black. And that Harriot Beecher Stowe was a white lady.


 
Posted by Charles Albert Green on Monday, August 21, 2006 - 3:56 AM
[Reply to this
Matt

 

Who cares that the man was left out of the movie.  You people are turning a national tragedy into a racial issue.  I mean, sure I can see how dude is upset, but the movie aint about him as an individual its about the courage of the FDNY and NyPD and those workers in the building who died  an uneccesary death.  And I wonder if a story broke that a white man was replaced with a black man, if you would be as upset.

The main point is to not to exhaust your energy fighting a meaningless battle and to instead appreciate the movie for what it is. If you do got beef about the 'colored fella' then maybe drop Oliver Stone a note.  But I beg you not to get the hip hop community and the ethnocentric blacks aroused at this point becase it will eventually overshadow what the film actually portrays, basically just get over it.


 
Posted by Matt on Friday, August 18, 2006 - 5:00 AM
[Reply to this
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